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Discussion Starter #861
Finally had everything I needed to get the heads back on today :)

Both heads refitted, new bolts installed and then torqued down as per the manual.

The first pass was 20nm, second pass was 35nm, followed by another pass at 90 degrees, and a final pass at 90 degrees. My new torque wrench wouldn’t do the 20nm stage so I used the 3/8” torque wrench for them before switching to the new Snap-On wrench. The Snap-On one was great. It’s got the length in the handle to make it effortless to use. The final pass at 90 degrees didn’t even feel difficult.

The cams are also lubed up with the caps fitted and torqued in sequence too. These only go to 10nm.




The new timing chains, guides, tensioners and bolts are all laid out on the toolbox ready to sort the timing tomorrow.

Always seems a shame when fitting nice new shiny things to cover them up with the rest of the engine/intakes/supercharger on reassembly.

David.
 

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True that. Hard to keep them shiny.
Good that you’re at this stage at long last.

I’m staring at some black mechanical bits that are giving off a distinct smell of burnt oil.
 

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Discussion Starter #863
Bugger! That’s such a horrible smell too! Hopefully it’s something easy and not catastrophic.
 

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We think it’s the head gasket.
Bores look fine.
4,3 and 1 are dry but a little sooty. 2 is wet and oily. Oil level is at the bottom of the dipstick.
 

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Discussion Starter #865
Is the head gasket a bad job on those?
 

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I’ve posted some pics in the What did you do Today thread so I don’t pollute your thread David. It’s been fairly straightforward so far.
 
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Discussion Starter #867
Everything was about timing this afternoon…

I started with everything laid out on the toolbox so I could identify things as the tensioners for the secondary chains are sided.


After that I pulled up the manual and set about following the process for setting up the timing to a tee.


It was very straight forward, you put the secondary chains on the sprockets then put the sprockets on the cams and put the new bolts into the cams whilst leaving them loose so the sprockets can turn. Once you’ve done this you pull the pin out of the secondary tensioners.

You then build up the LH and RH primary chains by installing the guide, then installing the chain, then you add the guide for the tensioner and then you fit the tensioner. Once this is done you pull the pins on these too.

Once you’ve done this lot you use the special tool from the timing kit to hold the exhaust sprocket stationary whilst you tighten the inlet sprocket bolt to 20nm, then a further 90 degrees. Once the inlet sprocket is tight you do the same for the exhaust sprocket, and then repeat for the other head.

It was very simple and went without a hitch. I then removed the timing tools that lock the cams, lifted the car up and then pulled the pin out of the flywheel.

I then spun the engine over. 1 360 degree rotation of the crank is only a 180 degree rotation of the cams so I spun the crank around 8 times which is 4 complete rotations. Everything moved very freely and felt lovely when turning it by hand.

However, and unfortunately with this car there’s always a “However” 😩… the cams and crank were slightly out of line when I went to repin them.

So, everything was removed and the process was started again following the workshop manual to the letter. The results were the same :(

These tools should sit flush with the heads. One side was nipped so it was flush, the other side wouldn’t sit flush.

LH Head:


RH Head:


The pin for the crank was also out:


It took fractions of a turn to get everything to line up again when I stripped it but it’s still not right and at the moment I’m not sure what the solution is.

David.
 
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Can you not release the cam sprocket bolts, realign the cams so the timing is spot on then relock the bolts?
 

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I'm not 100% sure on these engines, I've not had one in bits, but I think the sprockets have alignment slots, rather than holes, for the retaining bolts.
 
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Discussion Starter #871
There’s no slots on the sprockets at all. They’re not even keyed onto the cams, they’re just held on by the torque on the bolts.



I released the sprocket earlier when I was starting to dismantle and the tensioner shot to maximum extension as the chain moved.

Someone on the RR forum has told me that it’d be fine to build up the way it is but I’m not happy with it.
 

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I released the sprocket earlier when I was starting to dismantle and the tensioner shot to maximum extension as the chain moved.
I presume you can reset the tensioner and reinsert the lock pin to reuse it?
 

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Discussion Starter #873
Yea, you need to remove them to do it and on the secondary tensioners that means removing the main chains, guides, and sprockets.

The bolts on the cams are torque to yield and the manual says to replace them so I’m reluctant to screw it up again!
 

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Discussion Starter #874
I spoke to our local JLR specialist today who said that this is normal until oil pressure has built in the tensioners. Anything up to around half a tooth is acceptable so I’m going to check it once more but believe I’m good to keep going with reassembly.
 

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I spoke to our local JLR specialist today who said that this is normal until oil pressure has built in the tensioners. Anything up to around half a tooth is acceptable so I’m going to check it once more but believe I’m good to keep going with reassembly.
I did wonder if it was something like this.

If you've followed all the steps to the letter, been back and reconfirmed it, then it's often just a quirk, feature or normal built in tolerance. At least you're being diligent and checking with someone who do these more often than yourself. It's not something you want to get wrong as things can go wrong quicker than you'll ever be able to react.
 

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Had the same thing when I did the timing chains on the Stag - did it twice after it looked lined up to begin with, but wasn't quite after a few engine turns, then decided it was "within limits", lol. Runs fine.
 

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Discussion Starter #877
Tiny bit of progress tonight…

Checked and double checked the timing and I’m happy to leave it as is. I’d be surprised if it was half a tooth out.

I replaced the oil seal between the oil filter housing and the block as there was a huge oily mess down there so it was another “whilst I’m in here job”. That was after I’d spent ages scraping oily muck off the front and giving it a scrub with some degreaser.



Took longer to clean up then it did to change the seal. Nice easy job and the 3 mounting bolts torqued to 20nm.

Yesterday afternoon when taking a breather from the timing I’d given the front cover a good clean so I replaced the oil seals on that.



There are 3 o-rings inside the cover that seal bolt holes. I could only find one in my huge array of parts in bags so I had a look at my order and I’d only ordered 1. Looking at the parts catalogue it lists the o-ring but doesn’t show you 3 so although it’s annoying it’s easily rectified.



Once I’ve got these 2 o-rings I’ve got a new front main oil seal to go in too.

My old alternator was questionable, it was only putting out around 13.2v with the car running. When I removed it to do this job I noticed that there was no markings or labels anywhere on it. The LR one have the LR logo stamped into the case and had a Denso sticker on them too. All of the used LR ones on eBay still have these labels on them. My old one has no markings whatsoever on it so am assuming it’s a cheap pattern part.

On 16th July I clicked Buy it Now on a Genuine Denso alternator for £125. It was marked as dispatched on 18th July. I messaged the seller asking for a tracking number and he said he’d been in touch with Parcel Force who had said it’d be delivered on 26th July. The 26th came and went and no sign of it. I’ve chased the seller who has gone totally silent. 😡

I rang ParcelForce myself this morning and they confirmed that there are no packages in their systems for me from 15th July onwards so it’s pretty obvious it’s not going to arrive. I’ve raised a case with eBay so will need to wait and see now.

In the meantime, I’ve bought another Denso alternator which should be here tomorrow or Wednesday. 🤞

David.
 

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Discussion Starter #878
Had the same thing when I did the timing chains on the Stag - did it twice after it looked lined up to begin with, but wasn't quite after a few engine turns, then decided it was "within limits", lol. Runs fine.
This is the first time I’ve done timing chains so when spinning it over I expected it to be spot on like it is when you do a belt. I think part of me thought I’d got it wrong because it was such a simple process. 🤷‍♂️
 

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I found that the slightest alteration of the guides could put the cams out by a little. Never realised it was quite so sensitive to set-up, but you live and learn. Doing the timing chains is a "rite of passage" for a Stag owner, lol.
 
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Discussion Starter #880
None of the local dealers had (tried 2 Jaguar and 2 Land Rover) had the o-rings I needed in stock.

I can't do anything tomorrow evening so have ordered them from Duckworths Land Rover and should have them delivered here on Thursday now :)

David.
 
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